tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.comments2024-03-17T17:55:18.426-04:00AS BEREANS DIDMarthahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12438486498450616814noreply@blogger.comBlogger2274125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-9638410280698897002024-03-17T15:45:29.617-04:002024-03-17T15:45:29.617-04:00It’s mind boggling how deeply misled everyone is w...It’s mind boggling how deeply misled everyone is who is trapped in the mind-control of Armstrongism experiences. Bad research tactics, poor reasoning skills, biblical ignorance, misquoting documents and not bothering to make sure they aren’t misquoting the source material.<br /><br />Deception runs strong and becomes a stronghold on people. It doesn’t matter what cult you are being influenced by, it takes an act of God to wake people up.<br /><br />Thank you for all this research and for providing sources. I’ve read some of your citations and have read quite a bit of church fathers. I have been very surprised by how many are misquoted by the cogs. <br /><br />If you’re in a cog reading this comment, do your own research. Read the Bible without twisted interpretations. Accept Jesus Christs words as Gods Word. Let those strongholds be torn down. There is grace and truth and freedom waiting for you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-47658227416701749932024-03-10T10:20:19.183-04:002024-03-10T10:20:19.183-04:00A very heartfelt shout out to Terracet for helping...A very heartfelt shout out to Terracet for helping me on this post!xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-10656089988366656892024-03-07T14:01:08.199-05:002024-03-07T14:01:08.199-05:00Great article. I'll respond further later.Great article. I'll respond further later.jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-6058949570009650572024-02-22T21:27:56.253-05:002024-02-22T21:27:56.253-05:00Good points.
You saying "between the two eve...Good points.<br /><br />You saying "between the two evenings" brings something to mind. When they want to say Jesus rose on a Saturday, "between the two evenings" is late on Saturday, almost to Sunday. But, when they want to say the Jews ate the Passover at the wrong time, suddenly "between the two evenings" is early on the 14th, right after the end of the 13th.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-41603424845527900822024-02-22T12:24:58.933-05:002024-02-22T12:24:58.933-05:00Sorry to hear that. It is an additional great bles...Sorry to hear that. It is an additional great blessing when both spouses are on the relatively same page. I'm still hoping for that myself but making efforts to focus on faith and not the COGs. <br />The excluding of other Christians is what is the most damaging. As long as you recognize they are not necessary for salvation, the "practices" in the COGs are pretty minor really and probably are not necessarily a bad thing...services on saturday, observe some special days each year, don't eat pork/shelfish". <br /><br />It's really an easy practice...much easier than expressing care and concern and help to your fellow man.<br /><br />Yet, somehow the COGs think these three easy practices distinguish them from all the fake Christians (many of whom are devoted to helping others and spreading the Gospel). Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-52048968578603147242024-02-21T20:56:30.375-05:002024-02-21T20:56:30.375-05:00It seems strange that if Jesus rose "between ...It seems strange that if Jesus rose "between the evenings" on saturday evening as Armstrongism teaches in their Wednesday crucifiction/72 hour doctrine, why didn't some of the disciples show up at the grave at that time? Wouldn't they have wanted to be there after sundown Saturday to see Christ's resurrection? <br />For the Armstrongist 72 hours period, Saturday "between the evenings" was the absolute latest it could be, but again there is no mention of any disciples coming to the grave at that time or even some time before. Why not? <br /><br />One obvious reason is that the disciples knew that not enough days had passed since the crucifixion which would teach strongly against a Wednesday crucifixion.<br /><br />According to the Armstrongism timeline, why would the Marys wait 84 hours after Christ's burial to anoint Him with herbs/spices on Sunday morning? If Jesus was buried "between the evenings" on Wednesday evening, why didn't they come early Friday while His body would be fresher instead of waiting another 48 hours? <br /><br />One obvious reason would be that they knew Jesus was not in the grave on Friday morning.<br /><br />The 72 hour doctrine has a lot of logical inconsistencies. <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-13332042781932566552024-02-21T16:59:36.864-05:002024-02-21T16:59:36.864-05:00Hi Jim. I am so glad this was helpful! I really di...Hi Jim. I am so glad this was helpful! I really didn't know if it would be.<br />I totally agree with you. Such hubris in the leadership.<br /><br />I was married (past tense) and I do have kids. Was it smooth? Well, yes and no. I learned that she hated going and stopped believing a while before I did. That would have been helpful to know earlier. I don't feel she was entirely honest with me. That turned out to be a pattern later on.<br />So, no, I suppose we didn't recognize it at the same time.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-84236688549916187232024-02-21T12:46:25.251-05:002024-02-21T12:46:25.251-05:00Thanks for this.
My holding place was getting inv...Thanks for this.<br /><br />My holding place was getting involved with Christian members of my community and seeing their generosity and conversion even during disagreements. They lived the Gospel and wanted to share it, primarily done by example.<br /><br />I began to wonder, "Could these people really not have the Holy Spirit when they were displaying fruits of the Spirit greater than those I've known in Armstrongism?"<br /><br />Jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-69970458910635445782024-02-21T12:39:03.235-05:002024-02-21T12:39:03.235-05:00Very helpful and encouraging. I experienced simila...Very helpful and encouraging. I experienced similar cracks in Armstrongism. Strangely the thing that started waking me up was something very mild; the claim that the best way to observe the Feast of Tabernacles was to attend all the services including the opening night service.<br />At the time, I saw that services were only commanded on the first and last day of tabernacles, yet they seemingly knew better, insisting that services every day was the right way. I thought, "If so, why didn't God set it up that way?" <br /><br />So many things wrong in Armstrongism, but that was the one that got the ball moving for me. I suppose it is because this only required a simple reading of the Bible to see when services were commanded...and the hubris of the COGs to believe they knew better how to keep the FOT than the Biblical instruction.<br /><br />A question you can ignore:<br /><br />You were married and had kids as you were leaving Armstrongism. Was that smooth? Did you and your spouse recognize this at the same time?<br /><br />Jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-85805732657139195562024-02-21T12:16:33.674-05:002024-02-21T12:16:33.674-05:00Very interesting! I was not even aware that the P...Very interesting! I was not even aware that the Pharisees and Sadducees had a different view on this. I like your take. It displays Christ rising and bringing unity.Jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-1866795798540995412024-02-02T20:57:45.954-05:002024-02-02T20:57:45.954-05:00Hi, Set Free.
Your comment touched me. Thanks for...Hi, Set Free.<br /><br />Your comment touched me. Thanks for reading.<br /><br />The thing about writing on this blog is we rarely get to know who, if anyone, is really being helped. We do our best to keep things private and safe for our readers. If someone wants to read in secret, that's fine with us. If Ministers want to come here and do oppo research (I know they do) we're fine with that, too. We don't try to figure out who is popping in, so it's usually a mystery to us who is reading. But at the same time it's hard to know if we are being helpful. If people don't comment to let us know what they liked, we might never know. I'm glad you commented and happy God was willing we could help you.<br /><br />I can write about my exit. I used to write more about those kinds of things over at my old blog, xhwa.blogspot.com. Anymore, I write about deeper topics. If it would help, I'd be happy to write more about how to leave and what it was like. That was a difficult time. I can see how it might help someone if I share my experiences. I'll see what I can do.<br /><br />God bless! I pray He continues to guide you, gently, into a deeper relationship with Him.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-74386787004368080932024-02-02T17:38:26.567-05:002024-02-02T17:38:26.567-05:00This blog was admittedly jarring the first time I ...This blog was admittedly jarring the first time I landed here. What started as questioning one doctrine led to questioning another and another until I found myself on this blog, secretly reading the posts and comments realizing the posts were what I had come to understand from my own private moments with God and the scriptures.<br /><br />I’m not sure there is a one size fits most approach to helping people embrace the truth (the Way, the Truth and the Life, aka Jesus Christ). That’s why we can be grateful for the work of the Holy Spirit. I know I wouldn’t have been ready to read anything here if God hadn’t started nagging me with the half quoted, misused scriptures during sermons and in articles. When God did finally shake me hard enough to wake me up, that’s when I started googling the origins of the doctrines and ended up here.<br /><br />This blog has been one resource among many I’ve consulted. I appreciate the content and I agree with Jim that a guide past the cult influence and into the light of the gospel would be helpful. Healing takes time, but I know early on I started hoping to find a how-to move forward. Your post on that helped as well.<br /><br />Perhaps articles about the first time you went to a different church, etc.?Set Free and Gratefulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-49249463505188385142024-02-02T12:59:25.250-05:002024-02-02T12:59:25.250-05:00Thank you, Anon.
Couldn't agree more.
And you...Thank you, Anon. <br />Couldn't agree more.<br />And you're probably right about the 72-hours, too. It always seems to come back to that.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-19355689136754796862024-02-02T11:35:22.406-05:002024-02-02T11:35:22.406-05:00This is awesome! Thanks for sharing. It makes sens...This is awesome! Thanks for sharing. It makes sense that God would demonstrate perfect timing and His infinite wisdom by using the Law/the tutor to point us to Christ. I’m sure the complaint will continue to be, “yes, but it’s not 72 hours!”<br /><br />To acknowledge Good Friday and Easter Sunday is reasonable and not steeped in falsehoods requires humility. Repenting from believing men over the word of God is a continual process. You first have to let God speak for Himself.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-13664124466791755572024-01-22T17:01:00.127-05:002024-01-22T17:01:00.127-05:00I've made the decision to completely rewrite t...I've made the decision to completely rewrite this article. It's basically the same topics, worded very differently. I never liked how it explained the timing. Plus, I've learned a couple things since it was originally posted. I think this new version does a better, albeit far from perfect, job.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-21105694952467712402024-01-20T07:53:07.928-05:002024-01-20T07:53:07.928-05:00Well, Jim. Your request is honorable. I will see w...Well, Jim. Your request is honorable. I will see what I can do. <br /><br />At the risk of sounding self-serving, I recommend reading through the articles on this blog for ways to help your family yet in Armstrongism. I know you have been already, and I thank you for that. Use this blog as a reference. It may help you and them. Point them to us.<br /><br />Here's some insight that might be of use. No one who truly believes in Armstrongism leaves it because of rational argumentation. It's all emotion. So it needs an emotional solution. <br />We first have to experience something that causes us to accept there is a serious issue. That has to be personal. It's different for everyone, but it has to affect us personally. Then we need to give ourselves permission to question. That's where As Bereans Did comes in. We give the other side of the story most people weren't ready to hear until this point. This is genuinely terrifying, so it takes time. Small bites. After that, there needs to be some emotional event that is significant enough where the desire to leave outweighs all those excuses to stay. Knowing the system is wrong isn't good enough. Maybe if there is someone on the outside we trust, someone in our family perhaps, who can guide us out gently, help us navigate the great unknown, then we might just go.<br /><br />That's your biggest job. Not arguing over doctrine so much, but loving and waiting. The keys are patience and prayer. Lots of it! Because it might take years.<br /><br />God be with you!xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-76251713765390978772024-01-02T23:58:30.533-05:002024-01-02T23:58:30.533-05:00Will give it more thought. The content here is ex...Will give it more thought. The content here is excellent and well presented. I think more articles in moving forward from Armstrongism would be helpful. Perhaps also how to help or live with family yet in Armstrongism.<br />But, I’ll pray on this as you are all not done with your work.Jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-40069642884315586242023-12-27T20:44:42.949-05:002023-12-27T20:44:42.949-05:00I have never been truly happy with how this post w...I have never been truly happy with how this post was written. It was too much, too long, too confusing. I keep tinkering on it. I just made a few changes for readability, and to fix a broken link, and I hope this is the end of it. xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-34691825034077097842023-12-27T19:37:59.615-05:002023-12-27T19:37:59.615-05:00Thank you, Jim. We very much appreciate you visiti...Thank you, Jim. We very much appreciate you visiting and leaving your kind words. <br />Your comment was awaiting moderation, and I was so busy tonight I just couldn't get to it. Apologies.<br /><br />I especially appreciate your mention of the reverence for God. Seeker always tried to be reverent and humble. We tried to follow that example. We aren't always successful. But it's good to serve a God of grace.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-72277711501875503982023-12-27T11:45:37.205-05:002023-12-27T11:45:37.205-05:00Not sure if my first post went through, however I’...Not sure if my first post went through, however I’m grateful to again express my appreciation for the wonderful work Seeker provided. I’m saddened for the passing of someone who showed the flaws and even deception of the wcg while maintaining a website that showed and taught reverence to God.jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-17356923640360550242023-12-27T01:10:34.125-05:002023-12-27T01:10:34.125-05:00I too am very sorry to hear of seeker’s passing. ...I too am very sorry to hear of seeker’s passing. This is a phenomenal website that has helped me mightily. Reverence always given to our Lord despite having to show the many falsities of Armstrongism.jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-64840732290820970262023-12-18T12:40:58.638-05:002023-12-18T12:40:58.638-05:00Thank you Paul for your kindness. Glad we could be...Thank you Paul for your kindness. Glad we could be of help. Merry Christmas to you!<br /><br />Thank you Henrik. You've been a reader here for years and I appreciate you kind words so much, my friend.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-68322545895121870132023-12-18T08:21:28.564-05:002023-12-18T08:21:28.564-05:00and benefited I have.
Thank you all so much!
Merry...and benefited I have.<br />Thank you all so much!<br />Merry Christmas! Paul Nnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-15390769984856697422023-12-16T16:50:53.434-05:002023-12-16T16:50:53.434-05:00Sincere condolences and best wishes at this time. ...Sincere condolences and best wishes at this time. Thanks for the effort in restoring common sense among those reading the posts Seeker wrote.Henrik V Blunckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17977028543812049468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5528158760608808912.post-3001947288240268732023-12-13T18:45:39.991-05:002023-12-13T18:45:39.991-05:00I read this article a few more times over the past...I read this article a few more times over the past couple days and realized a few new things that never occurred to me before. So, I revamped it. I also edited it for readability. I like it a lot better now.xHWAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01061716053302210598noreply@blogger.com