Showing posts with label Holy Spirit. Show all posts

I am reposting this article. However, it differs from the original in that there are a few alterations and additions. I will follow up with a related article on July 7TH.

************

It is my hope that those who believe that, or are not yet sure if, Ron Weinland is a prophet or that what he teaches is truth will do as the Bereans did, to check the scriptures to see if what he says is true. My hope also, is that you will follow my suggestions in the box below.

First, Ron claims that Jesus is not Yahweh and also that those who teach this are mistaken. I have scripture that says otherwise. Why does it matter? Because he uses this lie to assist in the denial of Christ having always existed.

I will open with,

2Jn. 7 Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming (G2064 having come) in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist. V.8 Watch out that you do not lose what you have worked for, but that you may be rewarded fully. V.10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. V.11 Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work.

Ron dismisses the truth of:

Jn.4:2 This is how you can recognize the Spirit of god; Every spirit (G4151 The rational soul) that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God.

He says this scripture is NOT about a self existent eternal Jesus coming to earth in the form of a flesh body, rather about Jesus dwelling in our flesh. This is a lie! When scripture speaks of the Holy Spirit dwelling in us, it is quite clear, and this scripture is not one of them! Ron claims people just don't understand the bible, then proceeds to explain what the scripture 'REALLY' means! I'll make an entry later, that covers the topic of whether or not we must be taught by others (clergy), as opposed to the Holy Spirit.

Why say he came in FLESH if he had a beginning? It would be stating the obvious. Anyone born, is of the FLESH. However, if God had been made flesh, it then makes sense to state it. Moreover, why would scripture mention anyone denying Jesus’ Spirit dwelling in us? Are there any scriptures you have seen that talk about people that don’t acknowledge Jesus’ Spirit dwelling in us? I haven’t seen any. When the Bible talks about the Holy Spirit dwelling in us, it is quite evident!

I won’t take the stance that he has: 2008—God’s Final Witness, Page51,

'I am simply to state the truth as it is. I do not have to spend endless hours defending it, debating it or expounding upon it. The truth is simply the truth…' (Bold his).

Rather, my stance is 1Pe.3:15….”Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect.”

This is my aim here. To offer the proofs of my belief statements.

When I first began listening to Ron and heard his questionable teachings, I spent ten months searching scriptures to see if what he said in his sermons and books were true. I found many of his teachings to contradict the Bible!

If you have an interlinear you will see that Jer. 23:5-6 Is talking about Jesus and that in v.6 it says the name he will be called by is the LORD our Righteousness.
Two things; * Ron explains: that LORD, all caps, in the bible, is the word Yahweh (H3068 Eternal, Self-Existent) which is true - see your interlinear,
* and that only the Father is called Yahweh and that Jesus is not. However, this verse says otherwise. Verse 5 and 6 are talking of the coming of Jesus in the flesh. It says in v.6 he will be called Yahweh.

5 "The days are coming," declares the LORD,
"when I will raise up to David a righteous Branch,
a King who will reign wisely
and do what is just and right in the land.

6 In his days Judah will be saved
and Israel will live in safety.
This is the name by which he will be called:
The LORD Our Righteousness.

Zec.2:8 For this is what the LORD (G3068 Yahweh-Eternal; self-existent) says: After he has honored me and has sent me against the nations… [The Father sends the Son, the Son doesn’t send the Father. These two verses make it quite clear that they are both called Yahweh.]

8 For this is what the LORD Almighty says: "After he has honored me and has sent me against the nations that have plundered you—for whoever touches you touches the apple of his eye-
9 I will surely raise my hand against them so that their slaves will plunder them. Then you will know that the LORD Almighty has sent me.

Now, we see in 1Tim. 3:16 [if you have an interlinear you will not be held back in your studies, and you will see this verse says,] God was manifested in flesh. [If you have a concordance, you may be able to find these translations in the back of it. The Strong's number for the words are as
follows]: v.16 He [actual Greek word translates; God (G2316)], appeared [translates; Manifested (G5319)] in a body [translates; flesh (G4561).]

If you don't have an interlinear but have a concordance that provides the Strong's Numbers, you can use it to find the original word and definitions in the back. However I prefer a Greek, Hebrew dictionary.

Php. 2:5-8 {Need interlinear to translate properly} says; v.6 Who, subsisting (G5225) in form of (G3444) God, did not consider equality with God to be plunder (G725) [i.e., something he should grasp and not let loose of], v.7 but emptied (G2758) himself [became flesh, no longer spirit], taking the very nature of a servant [did not come to be served but to serve] being made in human likeness. V.8 And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death [if you are flesh you die, that’s obedience to death]– even death on the cross.

If he was created, had a beginning, why say he was made in human likeness? Anyone born is in human likeness. If he was created, what did he empty himself of? If he was created, why say he was found in appearance as a man? What other appearance is there for a human? If he was created, what did he humbled himself of? If he was created, how did he become obedient to death? Are not ALL HUMANS obedient to death? Is there anyone who can defy death?

Obviously, we are all familiar with;

Jn. 1:4 the word became flesh. And,
Rev. 19:13 his name is the word of God.

So, do we ignore these scriptures and believe when Ron says the 'word' was the Father's spoken word and NOT a being who became flesh?

2 Cor. 8:9 talks about him giving up his spirit body for a flesh one, it says; Jesus was rich [spirit/eternal], yet for your sakes he became poor [flesh], so that you through his poverty [flesh body] might become rich [gain eternal life through his sacrifice].

1 Jn. 4:2 Jesus has come, (G2064 having come) in the flesh... Ron says this is talking about Jesus dwelling in us! Absolutely false. When the Bible talks about the Father or Jesus dwelling in us, it is quite obvious. This is not about that, but about Jesus having come in a flesh body; giving up his richness (spirit body) to be poor (flesh body) for our salvation.
What love, for our God to give up His glorious spirit body and take on the form of a flesh body, a body that does what our lowly human bodies do, sweat, go to the bathroom etc., Like any great leader, He left His 'desk' to be in the 'trenches' with His 'men', and in that human form He felt the pain of physical torture to the death, to save a bunch of unworthy humans! Truly, there is no greater love!
He gave up his spirit body and became flesh, relying on the Father to raise his flesh body from death and return him to the Glory he had before!

1Cor.15:47-49 says Adam was of the dust of the earth [flesh], Jesus the Lord (G2962 Kurios) out of heaven [spirit]. As was the earthly [flesh] man (Adam), so are those who are of the earth ; and as is the man from heaven, [spirit], so are those who are of heaven. And just as we have borne the likeness of the earthly [flesh] man (Adam), so shall we bear the likeness of the man from heaven [spirit].

Jn. 6:38-42 Note: v.38 For I have come down from heaven. V.41 The Jews began to grumble about him because he said, “ I am the bread that came down from heaven.” V.42 They said, “Isn’t this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How can he say ‘I came down from heaven’?” [What were they upset about? That God caused a virgin to birth him or that he claims to have come from heaven?]

Jn.6:62 What if you see the son of man ascend to where he was before?

Ep.4:9 What does “ascended” mean, except that he also descended…

Col. 1:16-18 is talking about Jesus and says; for by him all things were created. And also the following scripture;

Jn. 1:10…the world was made through him…[How can something be created though him if he hadn’t been born yet because he had a beginning? Are we going to call this a metaphor or say 'it is BEING created through him everyday'? The bible CLEARLY is not saying that. We know it is speaking of THE creation.]

Heb 1:2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. [Again, how can the Father create a universe through an unborn son that doesn't exist yet?
And a quick note for those who may ask 'how can He inherit what is already his?' What makes you think he already owned it? Does your child own now, the family Bible you intend to pass onto them one day? No, it still belongs to you.

Note:

Jeremiah 10:16 He who is the Portion of Jacob is not like these,
for he is the Maker of all things,
including Israel, the tribe of his inheritance—
the LORD Almighty is his name.

[Israel is Yahweh's inheritance. This argues a couple of things;

1) the 'how can He inherit what He already owns?' question, is not a good argument to try to prove Jesus had a beginning, because this scripture says Yahweh inherits. Meaning; if only the Father is Yahweh, then the Father inherits...so this question, in regards to Jesus, doesn't hold water.

2)Who is the Portion of Jacob? Jesus is, and the One who is the Portion of Jacob is the Maker of all things, and His name is Yahweh. Meaning; Jesus is the Maker of all things and, Jesus is Yahweh also, not just the Father. Following, are a couple more;]

Zechariah 2:12 The LORD [Yahweh] will inherit Judah as his portion in the holy land and will again choose Jerusalem.

Psalm 33:12 Blessed is the nation whose God is the LORD, the people he chose for his inheritance.]

Heb. 1:10 [Now, go over this chapter carefully] v.8 But about the Son he says...V.10 He also says, in the beginning O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands.

Ron explains this away, saying that v.10 is about the Father creating. If that were true, this sentence would read something like this: The Father also says, "In the beginning O Me the Father laid the foundations… [The Father is not talking to himself, he’s talking to Jesus.]

Jg.6:11-14 [We know that LORD is Yahweh, and we see here that the angel of the LORD visits Gideon, and we see in v.11 that this messenger is Yahweh. So this ‘angel of the LORD is God and if only the Father existed at that time, as Ron says, then these verses are calling the Father, the Messenger (angel means messenger) of himself. Did the Father send himself to give a message to Gideon? No, he sent Jesus.]

1co.10:4 …drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them and that rock was Christ.

1 For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers, that our forefathers were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.
[This statement; ' accompanied them' is information Paul got from Ex. 13:21! (below), note the next three scriptures.]

Ex.3:8 (v.3-8) So I have come down to rescue them from the hand of the Egyptians and to bring them up out of that land….[Who came down to rescue them? Who accompanied them? Jesus, the Christ, as we see in the above scripture. Who was in the burning bush then? Well, I'd say Jesus, the Christ.]

Ex.13:21 By day the LORD [Yahweh] went ahead of them in a pillar of cloud..and by night in a pillar of fire.. [Yes, ahead of them was Jesus.]

Jg.2:1The angel of the LORD [messenger of Yahweh, Father and Son are each called Yahweh,] went up from Gilgal to Bokim and said,” I brought you up out of Egypt and led you into the land that I swore to give to your forefathers.

[The individual who is speaking says He brought them out of Egypt...this individual is the messenger of Yahweh. So this messenger of Yahweh brought them out of Egypt and led them to the land that this messenger of Yahweh swore to give to their forfathers. Did a created angel swear to give them that land? No.]

Zec.14:3-9 Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations, as he fights in the day of battle. On that day his feet will stand on the mount of Olives… [If “LORD” is Yahweh and if only the Father is Yahweh, as Ron teaches, then this would be saying the Father, and not Jesus, will fight and stand on the Mt. We know this is not the case.]

Ron also explains away (Gen.1:1) In the beginning God (H430 Elohiym) created the heavens and…. The New Strong’s Complete Dictionary of Bible Words, says: (H430 Elohiym; Plural of H433 Elowahh, eloahh; gods in the ordinary sense; but specifically used (in the plural thus, especially with the article –the-) of the supreme God).

Ron also points to (Is.45:18)…”I am the LORD, and there is no other.

Let’s look more closely at this.

In (V.1) we see he is addressing Cyrus, who is to be born in the future (v.13), telling him of His plans for him (v.14-16). Saying that Egypt and Cush will come to him in chains and, will be his. They will bow before him and plead with him, saying, “Surely God is with you, and there is no other; there is no other god.”(V.16) All the makers of idols will be put to shame and disgraced… (V.18) …”I am the LORD, and there is no other. This is in reference to idols.

Does it matter? Is it important?

As Ron says in his book 2008—God’s final witness, on page 46:

“If some doctrine or belief in God is a lie, then by its very definition it cannot be true or from God. People who embrace any of the thousands of ‘Christian’ beliefs need to know what their church teaches, where their beliefs originate, and whether they truly come from God. If they find lies, then they must change or willingly submit to what they know is false, and thereby be guilty of opposing the one true God.”

[And I know you are aware this doesn't exclude Ron.]

He asks, on page 50 in regard to Sunday worship:

Why do they feel they must defend this doctrine themselves by twisting and misrepresenting scriptures so that they seemingly indicate that there is some validity in …

[whatever the subject may,] (underline and bold, mine).

I ask this same question of those who believe the biblical contradictions that Ron teaches. Contradictions that require twisting and, misrepresentation of scriptures so that they seemingly indicate that there is some validity in what he teaches. Contradictions that one can easily see with:

• simple study of scripture, (as the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians because they searched the scriptures daily to see if what Paul said was true, Ac.17:11), And

• a desire to see the truth regardless of the source and,

• a willingness to not so readily defend a doctrine that may- by discovery of any particular scripture- be a lie, because you think, or thought your original source or belief to be correct.

Are we interested in defending our belief in something, at any cost, or are we interested in the truth even if it pulls the rug out from under us? Is your heart in pleasing God?

One final thought/scripture to leave you with;

Isaiah 43:10

10 "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, [Yahweh (H3068 Eternal, Self-Existent]
"and my servant whom I have chosen,
so that you may know and believe me
and understand that I am he.
Before me no god was formed,
nor will there be one after me.

So.... If Jesus had a beginning... a God WAS formed!
Someone is NOT telling you the TRUTH!
And God is no liar.

What of those who choose to be under the Old Covenant, what of their fate? Do they have the Holy Spirit? Is their salvation at stake? If not, where do they wind up in the Kingdom? What resurrection do they receive?


These are questions I have been asking myself for two or three years now. I have realized, as of late, that there is obviously a consequence or Paul would have said nothing to the Galatians.
He would not have told them that they were alienating themselves from Christ, had fallen away from Grace. He would not have told them that Christ would be of no value to them at all.

If you do not keep the Holy Days or the Sabbath... guess what? Your salvation is not in jeopardy! I repeat, you, by no means, jeopardize your salvation by not keeping Sabbaths! There is nothing wrong, however, with observing them if you realize it is no longer commanded, as long as you know it's not a command and that salvation cannot be attained, or get you closer to attaining it by doing so.

Consider the following verses: Galatians 2:21 I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!"

[If you can gain salvation by keeping the Sabbaths, then.. Christ.. died.. for ..nothing. And if He died for nothing, He is of no value to you.
Consequence: If He is of no value to you, He cannot dwell within you, no Holy Spirit, because you are cut off from Him.]

Gal. 5:2 Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all.

[Notice his statement; "Mark my words" i.e.; "I'm warning you. If you rely on O.C. laws for salvation, Christ will be of no value to you at all."

Consequence: If Christ is of no value to you, you do not have Christ dwelling in you. He cannot pay your debt if you are relying on O.C.]


Gal.2:10 All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law."
[If you believe that keeping the Sabbaths are a requirement for attaining salvation, then you are under a curse because if you don't keep the law in it's entirety, flawlessly, you cannot be credited righteousness.
Consequence: Since, obviously, everyone sins; without repentance, on this path, you will be destined for the pit.]

Gal. 5:4 You who are trying to be justified by law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.
[If you rely on the O.C. laws for salvation, Christ is of no value to you- meaning; rather than receive salvation through Him, you are attempting to gain it by your own efforts.
Consequence: Without repentance, you are destined for the pit, because there is no such thing as a perfect human, and perfect is what you'd have to be in order to obtain righteousness though O.C. observances. You cannot have the Holy Spirit if you are cut off from Christ. You cannot receive the grace you have fallen away from.]

Gal. 4:30 But what does the Scripture say? "Get rid of the slave woman and her son, for the slave woman's son will never share in the inheritance with the free woman's son."
31 Therefore, brothers, we are not children of the slave woman, but of the free woman.
[The analogy that Paul uses here, of the two women, is so clear. The Slave Woman is the Old Covenant. The Free Woman is the New Covenant. We are not children of the Old Covenant, but of the New Covenant.
Consequence: Those who keep Old Covenant laws because they believe they are required to, will not inherit with the Bride of Christ. You will not be part of the Bride of Christ.]

Now, I know some, if not all of you don't believe you are keeping the Old Covenant, but you are.
Why do I say this? How do I know? Because the Bible makes it quite clear. The Sabbaths are Old Covenant, that is; the Mount Sinai law, which was given to the Israelites. Jesus ended that Contract when He died on the cross to pay our debt for the sins we commit and have committed. Which brought into effect, the New Contract.

Don't be so easily fooled into thinking that you are to keep things from the O.C. because you think Jesus magnified the law. He did not!

For goodness sake, do you really think that contracts cannot have similarities? Do you really think that if God were to give you a new contract, that it could not contain anything about Love? I know you're not that naive.

God can make as many contracts as He chooses and everyone of them can and will be about Love. Do you think God was so shortsighted that He used up His one contract that could contain Love? You have common sense, and you know that's a silly idea! Do you really think that if He makes a new contract and it doesn't use the ten examples written in stone, of what Love is and isn't, that it means this new contract permits sin!? Of course it doesn't.

Do you really need God to spell out for you what Love is? The ten items written in stone were merely ten examples of what Love is and is not, which didn't even include every sin that man has committed! It doesn't mention pedophilia, but that doesn't mean it's not a sin! So why would you think that by not being under the ten commandments, (part of the Old Contract), that it would mean sinning is okay?

You are keeping the old contract/covenant, you are not keeping a modified or amplified contract. That is not permitted! Paul tells us this is so;

Gal.3:15 Brothers, let me take an example from everyday life. Just as no one can set aside or add to a human covenant that has been duly established, so it is in this case.

So you see that the contract could not have been modified or amplified in any way!

As Christians we should know what we believe, and we should know why we believe it. At some point in time we should be able to somewhat easily lay it out for others who may ask us about what and why we believe what we do.
Read the book of Galatians and do some thinking. You are intelligent, and I know you want God's truth.
I know that if you read something in the Bible that doesn't quite fit with your current beliefs or make sense, you will ponder over it and consider it rather than just read past it and ignore it, because we are seekers of truth, and as such, we pour through the scriptures with the goal of getting to know God and learning about the things that will please Him. We are on a quest for truth. It's an ongoing education, so we may have to say; "Well, as I understand it at this point in time, I believe/think it means..."



You know what I think about the quest for truth and how to find it?

It's pretty simple actually;

1)WANT THE TRUTH
if you don't truly want it, you won't get it

2)DON'T ASK OTHERS WHAT THEY THINK THE TRUTH IS
leave it to God to reveal this, He is smarter than people

3)TELL GOD YOU WANT THE TRUTH
now that you know you want it, you need to tell Him you want it

4)TELL GOD YOU HAVE NO PREFERENCES FOR WHAT THE TRUTH IS
for me, I told Him; "It doesn't matter to me; if I am required to keep Sabbaths fine, if I am not required to, fine. I am only interested in pleasing you."

5)TELL GOD YOU ARE ONLY INTERESTED IN PLEASING HIM
we have no one to be loyal to but Him

6)GET A THREE RING BINDER WITH POCKETED SUBJECT DIVIDERS
this is better than a notebook, as it is easy to rewrite, add, and rearrange papers, the pockets/pouches are good for loose and/or small items

7)MARK THE SUBJECT(S) YOU WILL BE STUDYING IN YOUR BINDER
some of mine are; "Did Jesus have a beginning?"; "144,000"; "Accepting Jesus on the death bed"; "Do we need to be taught by others?"; "Old/New covenant"; "Names of Jesus"

8)OPEN YOUR BIBLE

9)OPEN YOUR PAPER OR ONLINE INTERLINEAR
this is necessary for examining the Greek or Hebrew word in question

10)OPEN YOUR PAPER OR ONLINE GREEK/HEBREW DICTIONARY
this is necessary for examining the Greek or Hebrew word definitions for better understanding of a words meaning and translation

11)ASK GOD TO SHOW YOU HIS TRUTH

12)BEGIN TRACKING YOUR SCRIPTURES;
you will need to refer back to these frequently to remember what you are learning, they are also your references when sharing what you have learned with others.

13)BE WILLING TO INVEST TIME INTO YOUR QUEST
this is an ongoing commitment; Jer. 30:21 "...for who is he who will devote himself to be close to me?' declares the LORD."



So, what is the fate of the old covenant keepers? My understanding at this time is: Without repentance;

• alienated from Christ and thus,

• do not receive the Holy Spirit, the deposit, the guarantee of inheritance,

• not an heir with Christ

• not the Bride of Christ,

• destiny?...the pit.

With repentance;

• not the bride of Christ, and if not the Bride...

• destiny?...second resurrection...

• ... so where is your place in the Kingdom as one who is not part of the Bride?

I am interested in truth so, if anyone has any other insight on this subject, I would be happy to examine it if you would like to add something or if you feel I have overlooked something, or...

• Are there only to be 144,000 resurrected when Jesus returns?

• Abraham’s children are as numerous as the stars. Are only 144,000 of them to be resurrected? Are there only 144,000 stars?